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Michelangelo's David

Political Rumble at Starbucks: I Defend Obama And Utterly Destroy Conservative Talking Points

I had the opportunity to meet a couple of old friends at Starbucks today, Shawn and Robert.  I hadn't seen them in more than ten years.  Shawn is getting married next weekend and as we are both left-wing lunatics, we spoke about writing and, inevitably, politics. 

We were sitting outside talking about the upcoming election.  As we were discussing the upcoming election an elderly woman came to our table. "Do you mind if I interject myself into your conversation?"

"Not at all."

So she goes off on Obama, how he's a Muslim and this and that and why am I supporting him, and she ends with, "I just don't understand why those people on the Left support him."

I counted to five. (And, no, it's not something I normally do, as my writing buddy will attest.)  "First of all, I'm not 'those people'.  I'm an American like yourself.  And I'm not going to let you or anyone else on the right say otherwise or ever question my patriotism.   I won't put up with it. Understand that, first."

She blinked.  "Oh, sure, Democrats are Americans, too."

Now by this time I had decided I  would leave her eviscerated body to cool slowly under the umbrellas.  With cold ice emanating from my eyes and voice, I replied:  "Oh, how nice of you to finally admit Democrats are also Americans.  I suppose now you expect me to be grateful for recognizing the fact I'm also an American."

She knew she had stepped blindly into a bear trap and tried to change the discussion.  "Why do you support Obama?"

I explained to her politics was all about perception and I thought Obama would be able to provide the positivity and optimism the country needed.  Much more than McCain.  Then I starting to really cut into her:

"It's not my job to educate you as to why Obama is a Christian and not a Muslim. You're going to believe what you want to believe, for your own reasons.  Nothing I say, no reality, no factual evidence, is ever going to change your worldview because you have a vested interest in believing what you want to believe, for your own personal reasons.  But the fact remains Obama is a Christian, and nothing you say, and nothing you do, and nothing you believe will ever change that reality."

"Well, I don't like McCain, either," she said.  " I think he's a dangerous left-winger who will raise our taxes."

Now I was certain I was in the presence of a raving lunatic.  McCain a left-winger.  Right.  Robert starting going after her, too, questioning her talking point that McCain was a left-winger of all things.

"I agree this country is in poor shape," she went on, " and I think the Democrats will win because Americans want to strike back at something.  But they don't understand is Bush is the only president ever to be president during such hard times of war and trouble."

She was serious.  She was serious.

Okay.  This made me lose it.  Both Robert and Shawn were stunned to be in the presence of such raw, stupefyingly professed ignorance.

"ARE YOU KIDDING ME?  This is why conservatives can't be trusted with anything remotely approaching reality.  Are you saying FDR wasn't president during a time of strife?  He helped win WWII and get us out of the Great Depression.  And Lincoln, a Republican, held this nation together during a Civil War and you're standing there trying to tell me Bush is the only president in history to run this country during a time of trouble?  Your argument fails in the face of  hard, historical fact.  That's not me talking, it's the history of your own country. "

But she knew she had lost and was already walking away.  "You're right, you're right, there have been other presidents who were president during war."

"I'm certain FDR and Lincoln would be grateful for you to acknowledge that."  

As I was driving home I thought about what just happened.

Here's the foundational problem with Republicans, in my mind.  To be someone who professes how much they love and revere and respect this country -- in fact, no one loves and reveres and respects America as much as they do, to hear them tell it, they don't know a damn thing about its history.  When historical fact gets in the way of their talking points, they simply ignore them.  She was serious.  She wasn't acting.  She honestly believed Bush was the only president to be in the White House during a time of trouble.  She believed it.  She wasn't pretending. She was a hard right-wing Republican, by her own admission, and she was completely ignorant of her own nation's history. 

WWII?  The goddamn Civil War?  It wasn't on her radar.   It wasn't important to her.  My God.  My God.

You are never going to convince me otherwise that these people are dangerous.  They must be defeated on November 4 and their party must be destroyed and the political earth salted so we never see its like again. That's what is at stake.  Nothing less than the life or death of this country.

Yeah. It's that simple.  And that vital.

Comments

Cake. You get cake.
hooray!

*gobbles frantically*
It sounds as though she knew exactly what she was doing, and was hoping to play on your ignorance of the issues. I find it very hard to believe that she was that un-informed not only about the present electins, but about American history.

Wouldn't surprise me if she was a Republican trying to put doutb and fear into you.

BTW.....it's the Republican party that killed this bill. If the American economy collapses, blame them.
I don't know what she was doing, or thought she was doing. I was there, as amazing as it seems I think she was honestly ignorant of the fact other presidents rather than King George ran this country under times of strife.
I guess she missed that Bush is the CAUSE of a lot of the hard times and trouble huh?

The thing that gets me, what does it MATTER if Obama is a Christian or Muslim? Yes, I know it matters to some people, but it shouldn't. Muslim does not equal terrorist, and religion, by basis of the law should NOT be a factor.
You're right, it shouldn't matter, and it doesn't matter to people like you and me.

But here in the South, it unfortunately does matter to a lot of people because they see division first and dismiss ideas of unity. Also, other things matter to these same "Americans", like whether or not you're White, or Rich, or Christian...oh, and did I mention White? And don't forget White.
Yes, I'm acutely aware of the ignorance, and am resigned that you can't change people. I still can't stomach it when I hear it though. I've got a handful of people no longer speaking to me this election season because I objected when they've sent out those weird Nazi/Christian type emails that are going around about 'real' Americans. Have you seen those? I mean...YIKES! It feels like Invasion of the Body Snatchers around here lately, sincerely.
There are people I no longer speak to, either. I feel pretty good about it, actually.
I'm with you. Some days I don't think there is a chance to win against such ignorance. I would just be happy to reach a middle ground. Some days I feel like it is a sheer, bare-knuckle fight against the evils of ignorance, totalitarianism, and self-righteousness. And we have to put in 100% every day, with angry earnestness, just to get to anything nearing a halfway point between our worldview and theirs. Because the other option is so very, very easy. They don't have to work at it. Thinking and evaluating is hard work, and plenty of people are quite happy to circumvent such difficult processes.

And then some days I remember to relax and just enjoy the ride on this giant pincushion while I can.
Thinking and evaluating is hard work, and plenty of people are quite happy to circumvent such difficult processes.

It's *so* much easier to have prejudices reinforced and encouraged, than to engage in active questioning and research. One of my favorite sayings by the commentator Anonymous is, "You know your god is man-made when he hates all the same people you do."
Their way of life is exceedingly simple because it mirrors their internal philosophy. We do have the harder way, and it is a bare-knuckle fight to the death, which I don't mind at all....
"First of all, I'm not 'those people'. I'm an American like yourself."

I can't recall where I heard this, but it's apropos. "If you say 'they' or 'them' but can't name two actual people, you're dealing in stereotypes and your assumptions should be examined."

My mom and step-dad are evangelical Christians and I hear "they" and "them" quite often, especially when referring to gay or lesbian people. My wife and I, who are morally liberal, have agreed to hold our tongues for the sake of family peace. Each of us has worked for a gay or lesbian person, with nary a whiff of the issues raised by the Right during our employment.

While you may think our silence is ducking the good fight, let me offer another quote for your consideration:

Never try to reason the prejudice out of a man. It was not reasoned into him, and cannot be reasoned out. --Sydney Smith, English essayist (1771 - 1845)
I miss your grumpy ass!

Ah yes, those of us who grew up with people like her understand why Fox News (Faux Noise) is so dangerous, because it gives them a public lie to justify their hatreds, prejudices and ignorance.

Grumpy is the new cool!

Fox is nothing more than a propaganda machine designed to validate the fear, hate and racism that is endemic with Rat Pigs.

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